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Paidverts slow ad clicks deliveries

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tupko
Traffic Value: $32,122.18249 Croatia (LOCAL Name: Hrvatska)
10 like this post 2 people
23/11/2014 13:34
hello everyone! smile

I am concerned and want to raise awareness about this.
sorry if there is a thread already open somewhere.

some time ago I saw few people discuss this offtopic(I don't remember which thread it was)
and they got me thinking,

when you buy bulk ads, paidverts promises to deliver all ads in 180 days otherwise it will refund you 0,02$ per undelivered click. fair game

now, since I got to one of the mid-higher groups(9) normally I started buying larger amount of ads/clicks.
Meaning, my demand for ads increased but paidvert's daily click deliveries stayed the same.
I quickly realized that this problem of undelivered ads is pretty much around the corner.

I took one of my bigger ad campaigns for example, which has been active for 20 days(160 days to go) and delivered 585/13300 clicks, by this rate, not taking growth of the site into consideration, I'll have only 5265/13300 clicks after 180 days and the rest of it refunded.

what's troubling me, how is paidverts going to deal with it? because, you can't just refund undelivered ads with the money, what about already received BAP we got by purchasing undelivered bulk ads??
they should be removed too, you can't have something you were refunded for!

e.g. It's like going into computer shop, buying the whole pc set in a package(monitor, keyboard, mouse, pc...)
and then after 15 days, refunding a purchase but not returning a monitor and keyboard to the shop. computer shop just lost a monitor and a keyboard in this instance

BAP should be deducted from our account too otherwise paidverts will start losing money.

one of the not perfect solutions, bulk ads will need to offer less clicks than now - 50 clicks per 1$ purchase
or bulk ads should be charged more than 1$ and we definitely need more clickers, more lower group members

I need thorough explanation here please, because I don't see logic in here.
hikineet
Traffic Value: $5,041.18779 Malaysia
3 like this post 0 people
23/11/2014 13:42
Yes - this is something I am concerned about as well. 

I would like to see Jo officially respond to this as this issue has been brought up by other big users as well. 

Hopefully Jo already knows that this is an issue and already have plans on how to deal with it.
tupko
Traffic Value: $32,122.18249 Croatia (LOCAL Name: Hrvatska)
0 like this post 0 people
23/11/2014 13:47
by my calculations if the daily click rate doesn't change, all bulk ad purchases approximately above 140$ cannot be delivered within 180 days.

and right now by my understanding, undelivered ads means free bap, Jo should remove bap from all the accounts who were refunded undelivered clicks, the amount of bap removed should be exactly the amount of the refunded money - e.g. 100$ refunded of undelivered ads = 200 000 BAPs removed from that account
peanutdude
Traffic Value: $360.6696 Philippines
4 like this post 0 people
23/11/2014 14:20
I brought this up once,

Jo basically said it is not a problem.

But I totally disagree with Jo, yes, it is not a problem at the moment, but this will become a huge problem when this site takes off member wise.

I suggested this and will suggest it again.

You need to reward the small clicker, something like this.

On recycled ads, for every 100 .0005/.001 guarantee a .05 recycled ad.  (this would not cost the site anything, and would get more of the new members to buy the recycler because of the extra money reward, and thus get more overall clicks).

Another option:

Allow any member under 90,000 BAP to buy additional ads (like the micro)

but make the ad distribution as follows:

30 .0005
10 .001

Cost would be 50 BAP and can be purchased 2 or 4 times.

I also, suggested to Jo, that the daily issue needs at least 50 ads for each member, like the one day a week or so ago.
pythagoras
Traffic Value: $4,007.84228 Netherlands
2 like this post 0 people
23/11/2014 14:43
Yes, there are several topic that talked about that. 

Basically if you get a refund of the ad you have to give the BAP back too in my opinion.
It will not be a problem because you can buy back the BAP for the refund. 
All that happens then is a reset of the time of the ad. 
colasander
Traffic Value: $386,747.05153 Netherlands
1 like this post 1 people
23/11/2014 14:59
Jo should just issue more (smaller) ads. Like a lot of ads under 0.02 and it will be solved eventually.
tupko
Traffic Value: $32,122.18249 Croatia (LOCAL Name: Hrvatska)
0 like this post 0 people
23/11/2014 15:09
@colasander
that's not the real solution to the problem,
if your theory is applied in daily ad distribution, more delivered ads for less $  would help speed up the process of delivering ads,
for example top group instead of 500$ ads get 5 x 100$ but also it should be concerned not to distribute too many ads but a reasonable amount because people are not bots and cant click 100 ads daily for instance

we need more people to click ads, fresh new recruits
colasander
Traffic Value: $386,747.05153 Netherlands
0 like this post 0 people
23/11/2014 15:27
Offcourse not. Every $1 means 50 views to the website distributed, so the average should be below $0.02. So if every member gets at least 51 ads a day, than we are going the right way.
tupko
Traffic Value: $32,122.18249 Croatia (LOCAL Name: Hrvatska)
0 like this post 0 people
23/11/2014 15:32
@pythagoras
yes, you can simply restore your bap by purchasing ads with your refund, no big deal
in my opinion the only real solution so far, if you get refunded, remove the bap too

@peanutdude
I agree with you that if Jo doesn't act, this could become a serious problem,
to simply put it in, members in the top and higher groups, including me, are basically stealing from paidverts

I'd really want to hear from Jo about this potential problem we are about to have in the future
peanutdude
Traffic Value: $360.6696 Philippines
0 like this post 0 people
23/11/2014 15:41
Your calculation is only assuming member are spending $1 per day on average.

That is not the case.

What Jo needs to do, is make sure the system sends out at least 1 more ad than was purchase for that particular day.  (count does not include recycled)

Use the BAP ads for the 8 oldest ads (until used up), taken at 00:00 server time.

The next 24 oldest ads needs to be used for the micro ads.

If there is not enough clicks left (in the 32 oldest) to cover the entire order, then it sends until the ad is finished (assuming the recycler will finish any not clicked), then start with the 33rd oldest ad

the 16 ads with the most clicks remaining (not in the 32 oldest), need to be used in the daily issue (1 to every member, until the ad is finished or no longer in the most clicks remaining 16).
tupko
Traffic Value: $32,122.18249 Croatia (LOCAL Name: Hrvatska)
4 like this post 1 people
23/11/2014 16:47
colasander, we are going in no way if the members are not clicking as much as there is demand for clicks in the paidverts.
right now the click delivery demand is too high in comparison to members we have clicking daily, that's why is slow.
personally, I don't mind it being slow because I'm not a genuine advertiser as many people here (otherwise I'll be buying cheap ads with unique visitors and faster delivery) as long as it gets delivered but not returned BAP for the refund you get is what's bothering me the most and I want an answer!

you can distribute as much ads as you want but that won't guarantee that people will click.
personally, if you give me 50 ads, I guarantee I won't click them all because I don't have that much time to do that every day.

I know this is not a good thought but an idea of forcing members to click a certain number of ads(or free ads) in order to let's say cashout or access forum or something similar would help speed up deliveries greatly
or let's say lowering the active account cap to 7 days instead of 21 day would be a great incentive for people to click more bap ads.

I understand that paidvert's key to sustainability is reducing debt as much as possible and that's why certain actions done over the last few months such as bap tax, less valued daily bap ads and especially milestones removal was necessary, but this get-refunded-and-don't-return-your-bap thing is pure debt increasing
yallit
Traffic Value: $2,148.94717 Philippines
2 like this post 4 people
23/11/2014 18:09
Additional suggestions:

1. Instead of 8 X 25BAP ads, should be changed to 20 X 10BAP ads.
2. Members should view at least 10 activation ads every 14 days instead of 21.
3. Include BAP Group 0 in the daily ad distribution. They can probably receive 4 X $0.0005 ads. If you do the math, they'll only be allotted a maximum amount of $40 for that group. The site doesn't have to shell out that extra amount. We can readjust the earnings of the higher groups for it. That $40 can easily be conjured by taking out $0.03 from daily ad issue of Groups 8 -14.
tupko
Traffic Value: $32,122.18249 Croatia (LOCAL Name: Hrvatska)
4 like this post 0 people
23/11/2014 18:37
I would agree to a certain point with you,
1. 20 ads is too much, 8 seems ok so far although it could be stretched to 10 x 20 bap ads without any heavier whining from lower groups but slightly better performance
2. lowering active acount days cap thus increasing the need to click activation ads would surely be a good plan, but how much would be optimal is the question? I'm thinking 7-10 days cap with every activation ad clicked adding 2-3 days more
3. lower bap groups don't need more bashing and reducing their earnings is not a good option since they click the most instead if possible I'm in for rewarding them in any way for their large amount of clicks
Remember, paying people out isn't the problem here, but delivering ads in 180 days(6months) time frame is, and if things start to scale greatly it could lead to payout problem

hopefully paidverts is ,soon to be 8 months, old program and probably there is no or very little undelivered ad refunds with unreturned baps
yallit
Traffic Value: $2,148.94717 Philippines
4 like this post 0 people
23/11/2014 18:47
My suggestion wasn't to decrease the earnings of the lower BAP groups. Instead, my suggestion was to include BAP Group 0 (100 BAP to 1599BAP) in the daily ad distribution wherein a $0.03 adjustment from Groups 8-14 (higher groups) will suffice. If you consider Groups 8 and 9 as low BAP groups, then the adjustment can come from Groups 10 - 14 or even just from Group 13-14 then.

Group 0 is comprised of 19347 members(based on Nov 21 ad issue). If they at least receive 4 X 0.0005 ads, that's a total of 77500 X $0.0005 ads that will be issued to that group. Even if only 10% of them will click those 4 ads, that will still be additional 7750 ads that will be clicked during daily ad distribution.
bigbadmoose
Traffic Value: $520.60691 United States
3 like this post 0 people
23/11/2014 18:50
https://www.paidverts.com/member/system_statistics.html lets look at the system stats does not have a break down of how old the undelivered click are but you can see there enough there to keep us busy for awhile.
tupko
Traffic Value: $32,122.18249 Croatia (LOCAL Name: Hrvatska)
3 like this post 0 people
23/11/2014 19:03
a week ago or so I traded in all my baps for shares and now I'm in that group and believe me group 0 also has "daily ads issues" except they are not count as daily ads like for all other groups because they are so minimal - I think Jo calls them micro ad issues and they are distributed to all members without ad filter no matter what group - today I got 25x0,0005$ ads
Bortoff
Traffic Value: $314.44564 Japan
0 like this post 1 people
23/11/2014 19:11
i think its because ads are being push out to people who quit who still have activation time left. or they dont push all the ads to accounts for people to see .  i would like to see the ad expiration time cut in half . i think that would be more effective.
tupko
Traffic Value: $32,122.18249 Croatia (LOCAL Name: Hrvatska)
0 like this post 0 people
23/11/2014 19:20
we've got cheap ads with 15 sec timer in that case, those kind of ads are pure revenue makers for the site, debt removers, more products like that and we'll speed up
awaiting geotargeted ads
Beljalex
Traffic Value: $3,515.97345 Canada
4 like this post 0 people
23/11/2014 20:04
Well, we see what could happen in the future. We all know that there is less clicks because there are more advertisers and fewer members who want to click hundreds of low value ads daily.

Would you click 100 ads x $0.0005? It would take you at least 100 x 90 sec (to be conservative): 2.5 hours to earn $0.05!!! I certainly would not. A lot of members systematically recycle $0.0005 and $0.001 ads. When members buy the mini upgrade ($0.05) they receive hundreds of recycled low value ads (without AdFilter). We must be grateful to those members devoted to click so much ads.

Many new members quit after a few time as their earnings is not worthy to time spent in clicking ads. Furthermore as soon as they can many members purchase the AdFilter to avoid receiving these low value ads, so again we get fewer members to click 0.001$ and 0.0005$ ads. 

If we receive more ads daily that we must click, members wont be glad and more members will stop clicking. I we need to click 50 ads daily (unless by buying the mini upgrade), I won't be willing to do so, it takes too much time. I will put my AdFilter higher.

1- Decrease time waiting for an ad according to the ad value as suggested many times in previous posts - so more people will click if it takes less time. Some members argue that advertisers pay for their ads to be viewed [that's true] but seriously, do you really pay attention to all ads you click waiting until 30 seconds are over? Hum, not sure. I have bought for more than $1k without any positive result (no inscription) on my sites. 
2- Give an intensive (as proposed above) to members who click so much ads, may be after they clicked 100 low value ($0.001$ and $0.0005) ads. Rewards  always create a positive effect on people.
3- If targeted advertising was available, I would use it and chose $0.01 value ads and higher avoiding these so low values. But we cannot buy BAP directly, we need to purchase AdPacks to grow our BAP (without control on their values) creating more and more ads to be delevered. I dont like to see that almost all my purchased ads are still active (16 on 18) and ad values are $0.0005. I understand why thay are recycled so often (e.g. delivered 552 and recycled 408). 

Another great advantage is that this would decrease servers resources demand, improve speed and save on costs.

And, the best decision is always to keep it as simple as possible.

I read Jo's daily news when he was writing about thinking of those low value ads. Maybe he already has found a solution.
Bortoff
Traffic Value: $314.44564 Japan
1 like this post 0 people
23/11/2014 20:13
most of the ads i have seen are mostly other ptc websites .  this one is by far the best one .
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